[SOLVED] Communication problems between two computers

[mark]

Dear @lauri and All,

This is such a mystifying problem. The fact that Lauri's machine shows a valid IP address in the system prefs, and that the she does not get one in Isadora is just really strange. It can only indicate that the creation of the UDP communications channels is failing for some reason... which could happen if the port was already in use, but the information Lauri provided above seems to indicate that's not the case.

Can you start by checking your firewall to ensure that you are allowing outgoing connections on the problematic computer.

If your firewall is open on that machine, then please follow the procedure here to allow apps from "anywhere" to run and let me know if that changes anything. (You can change it back after you've tried this by using "sudo spctl --master-enable" instead of "sudo spctl --master-disable")

To be clear for everyone, you don't need to move to a fixed IP address if you are using the Net Broadcaster and listener. A IP4 / DHCP connection is fine, as long as the router that is connecting the two computers supports multicasting, which normally it would.

As I said, I'm kind of stumped about this. I'm sorry for the bother Lauri, but this simply hasn't come up before. In situations like this where I'm really stuck, I usually ask users for access to their machine (under their observation of course) using TeamViewer. If you're open to that possibility let me know.

Otherwise, I'm probably going to have to compile a special version that outputs some kind of extra information that might show me what's going wrong when Isadora attempts to create its UDP communications ports.

Best Wishes,
Mark

[EdJoynson]

Ive had this issues before when using windows and mac machines not too long ago, I don't have a definitive answer on how we managed to get it working but we were suspecting issues with thunderbolt to Ethernet adapters and possibly when a mac is boot camped (and possibly using thunderbolt to Ethernet adapter). In the end after numerous restarts of machines they started working again, that was using a switch and static ips.

Sorry that isnt much help

Ed

[Fred]

@edjoynson on bootcamp the cable and adapted has to be plugged in before boot no matter what the IP configuration.

[EdJoynson]

@Fred yes I found this out the hard way quite a while back, even when plugged in before hand we still had issues. 

[Fred]

@lauri I was referring to the drop down menu that now says location automatic. Make a new location. Also to try make things simpler use only a wired network, no wifi, just one network connection as well. 

[Fred]

@edjoynson not sure what this was then. The plug in before boot is documented in the manufactures windows driver limitations.

[EdJoynson]

It sounds like very similar issues to what Lauri is having, we didn't think anything of it when it happened. The computer had an ip and could be seen by other computers when pinging them. But like described before, it didn't show an IP in Isadora. It happened on the mac for sure, cant remember about the windows machine. 

[Lauri]

@mark & all,

Thousand thanks for your replies and help.

I did what you Mark asked, and found the following:

System Prefs Firewall options Isadora was set to “Block incoming connections”. Sorry, should have thought about that. Changed Firewall options to “Allow incoming connections” for all Isadora versions, and got the IP address in Isadora prefs v2.6 and v.2.6.1b4. Although, the same procedure to Isadora v.2.5.2 this did not help – IP address shows 0.0.0.0 in Isadora 2.5.2 prefs.

However, the procedure to “allow apps from anywhere” did the trick – once. I had the same IP address in Isadora v.2.5.2 and system prefs once, and then I did this “sudo spctl --master-enable” and then “sudo spctl --master-disable” to again “allow apps from anywhere”, and IP address in v.2.5.2 prefs shows 0.0.0.0.

But what’s strange is that the Net Broadcaster - listener pair works in v.2.5.2, even in Isadora prefs the IP address shows 0.0.0.0. So, v.2.5.2 seems erroneously showing a wrong IP address in prefs. Anyway, now the Net Broadcaster - listener pair works in all versions I have (2.5.2, 2.6 and 2.6.1b4).

This all applies both to wi-fi and router (MacBookPro ethernet via a Satechi multiport adapter and a MacMini I’ve got at home). So it works in wi-fi network too, if both machines are in the same wifi network. I did not have the crossword ethernet cable with me now, so have to try that later.

I’m leaving for a longer trip the day after tomorrow, and now extremely busy, so cannot make a TeamViewer session now, sorry. Let’s think about that after my return in March, if still needed.

@mark Thank you again for your superb help!!!!

Best,

Lauri

[mark]

Troubleshooting Network Issues with Isadora@lauri said:

Anyway, now the Net Broadcaster - listener pair works in all versions I have (2.5.2, 2.6 and 2.6.1b4).

OK glad to hear that we finally got you up and running.

Team: @Michel @Skulpture @DusX @mc_monte @crystalhorizon - please keep this in mind for the future

I've just written this support article called "Troubleshooting Network Issues with Isadora" -- you can refer users to that if this comes up again.

Best Wishes,
Mark

[DillTheKraut]

@mark said:

Troubleshooting Network Issues with Isadora@lauri said:

Anyway, now the Net Broadcaster - listener pair works in all versions I have (2.5.2, 2.6 and 2.6.1b4).

OK glad to hear that we finally got you up and running.
Team: @Michel @Skulpture @DusX @mc_monte @crystalhorizon - please keep this in mind for the future
I've just written this support article called "Troubleshooting Network Issues with Isadora" -- you can refer users to that if this comes up again.
Best Wishes,
Mark

 Sorry Marc, if I'm intervening here, with all respect but i think the support article is a bit misleading about the multicast point!
I'm not 100% sure about how Isadora and the net Broadcaster is handling this, but how usually multicast software should do it. And as I already used the net broadcaster with several dumb hubs, I'm pretty sure that this works fine. And if I'm wrong about that, I would like to know how this is handled, because I want to know, why I need to buy expensive routers and/or switches with a specific function, unless I have a lot of traffic! Not talking to use several routers in one network, just to split it even without routing to another subnet.

This is how I understand multicast and effecting network devices (taken from here, https://support.symantec.com/e... as it was the most simple description I found):

----

Hubs, routers, and switches

Configuring a network to work with multicasting requires configuring the
physical devices that connect the computers to each other. These are
hubs, routers, and switches. A network uses hubs, routers, and switches
to send information from one part of the network to another part. Hubs
pass all the information they receive, without filtering it. Routers may
filter some information, and switches usually filter information.

In most cases, hubs do not require any configuration. Configuration is
required only in hubs that include capabilities that are normally found
only in routers or switches.

Configuring for multicasting

Configuring a router or switch to use multicasting requires that the
router or switch be IGMP capable. The specific steps that are used for
configuring any particular router or switch require information that is
specific to that router or switch. Information is usually available in
the documentation that accompanies the router or switch, or from the
manufacturer's Web site.

More information

If you suspect that your router or switch might not be correctly
configured for multicasting, you can test this possibility by using a
hub instead of a router or switch. If multicasting works when the
computers are connected through a hub, and not when they are connected
through a router or switch, the problem is probably due to the
configuration of the router or switch or to the number of hops between
the two computers.

-----

For my understanding, a full working, by all network devices supported multicast network is needed only, if you have a lot of traffic between them, like streaming video, or transmitting a lot of parameters parallel, etc.

And my personal extra bit is, that a simple non managed switch should usually work like a hub in this case and just broadcast the multicast signal. Only more expensive managed switches should have these issues.

Again, I might be wrong about this, but thus meaning everything I learned about RTP or audio protocol issues, like dante or  Motu might not be right, so I would be happy to get an update about this!

kindly
dill

[mark]

@dillthekraut said:

 Sorry Marc, if I'm intervening here, with all respect but i think the support article is a bit misleading about the multicast point!

 OK, well that's good to know. I had several situations where using a switch did not allow multicasting, but a router with the same computers did. 

Does anyone else know about this? I don't want to doubt dill, but I must admit I was basing this solely on experience.

Best Wishes,
Mark

[DillTheKraut]

@mark

As I understand it, routers only handle multicast between the LAN and WAN ports. If you have a router with multiple LAN, it most times is just a simple HUB function between them. Especially at cheeper ones.

About the switches, there are some 'simple' 5 or 8 port switches that looks just exactly like little small hubs or switches without any extras. These are not much more expensive than those, but are so called managed switches instead. These got an own IP address reachable by Web Interface or special manufacturer software. These switches have the possibility of priority settings or even port trunking or VLAN support. These switches are known to have issues with multicast handling, if they don't support igmp.

[Woland]

Just because it's relevant for this topic, in case other people in future need this info, here's a step-by-step tutorial for making multiple Isadora Computers communicate over Net Broadcasters or OSC

LINK

Best wishes,

Woland