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    alpha masking 3 layers

    How To... ?
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    • dbini
      dbini last edited by

      Hello folks,

      i'm trying to get my head around the Alpha Mask to create an effect, but can't seem to get things patched together properly to achieve the desired result.

      basically, i want to put a live performer into a photograph of the White House Press Room, so I have the full photo as a background, the podium cut out in Photoshop, (sitting on a transparent Alpha background) as a foreground, and I have a Chroma Key setup to remove the performer from a green background and place them on a transparent background.

      (does this make sense?)

      what I need to find out is how to layer things up so that the performer is cleanly over the full photo background, and the podium image is cleanly over the performer. Any ideas?

      John

      John Collingswood
      taikabox.com
      2013 MBPR 2.3GHZ i7 OSX11.7.4 16GB
      & 2019 MBPT 2.6GHZ i7 OSX12.3 16GB

      1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
      • keftaparty
        keftaparty last edited by

        Does this help ?

        I have no clean background so I did the chroma on my blue sweatshirt...

        The red background color should be your background image

        The yellow shape should be your foreground image.

        Of course the quality of the chroma keying strongly depends on your image quality ( camera, but also lighting etc... )

        Best

        Mehdi

        ...
        Mehdi Toutain-Lopez
        www.toutain-lopez.com

        1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
        • dbini
          dbini last edited by

          Hi Mehdi.

          I tried the layering Projectors thing, but can't get it to work. everything is either opaque or additive, changing layer doesn't seem to affect the outcome. i've never had any luck with layers - what am i doing wrong?

          (using a Shapes to simulate the performer on alpha)

          john

          John Collingswood
          taikabox.com
          2013 MBPR 2.3GHZ i7 OSX11.7.4 16GB
          & 2019 MBPT 2.6GHZ i7 OSX12.3 16GB

          bonemap 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
          • bonemap
            bonemap @dbini last edited by bonemap

            @dbini said:

            layering Projectors

             Did you try changing the blend mode of the projectors above the background to 'transparent'? In your screengrab the blend mode is set to 'additive'.

            Here is a patch that demonstrates layers using 3D quad actors instead of projectors - 2.5D Layers

            regards

            bonemap

            http://bonemap.com | Australia
            Izzy 3 STD/USB 3.2.5 | MBP 16” 2019 2.4 GHz Intel i9 64GB AMD Radeon Pro 5500 8 GB 4TB SSD | Mac Studio 2022 M1 Max 32GB | OSX 12.5.1 Monterey

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            • dbini
              dbini last edited by

              yeah - tried all settings, in the projector and also in IzzyMap. i got a slightly better result with the Layer 1 Projector set to Transparent (the orange Shape is solid)

              maybe my problem is with the Alpha of the top layer?? the file is a png that looks transparent in Photoshop. how can i test the transparency in Isadora? (ive tried changing the alpha type using the Alpha tool actor)

              John Collingswood
              taikabox.com
              2013 MBPR 2.3GHZ i7 OSX11.7.4 16GB
              & 2019 MBPT 2.6GHZ i7 OSX12.3 16GB

              1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
              • dbini
                dbini last edited by

                and @bonemap - i'm not seeing transparency in the output of your 2.5D layers patch either!!! is there a global setting somewhere?

                John Collingswood
                taikabox.com
                2013 MBPR 2.3GHZ i7 OSX11.7.4 16GB
                & 2019 MBPT 2.6GHZ i7 OSX12.3 16GB

                bonemap 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                • bonemap
                  bonemap last edited by bonemap

                  Hi John,

                  your top layer should definately be set to transparent. The PNG file from photoshop might be the problem.

                  best wishes

                  bonemap

                  http://bonemap.com | Australia
                  Izzy 3 STD/USB 3.2.5 | MBP 16” 2019 2.4 GHz Intel i9 64GB AMD Radeon Pro 5500 8 GB 4TB SSD | Mac Studio 2022 M1 Max 32GB | OSX 12.5.1 Monterey

                  1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                  • bonemap
                    bonemap @dbini last edited by

                    @dbini said:

                    not seeing transparency in the output

                     That sounds strange, I have no idea why. How are you previewing the patches? 

                    best wishes

                    bonemap

                    http://bonemap.com | Australia
                    Izzy 3 STD/USB 3.2.5 | MBP 16” 2019 2.4 GHz Intel i9 64GB AMD Radeon Pro 5500 8 GB 4TB SSD | Mac Studio 2022 M1 Max 32GB | OSX 12.5.1 Monterey

                    1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                    • dbini
                      dbini last edited by

                      force stage preview gives me this: 

                      John Collingswood
                      taikabox.com
                      2013 MBPR 2.3GHZ i7 OSX11.7.4 16GB
                      & 2019 MBPT 2.6GHZ i7 OSX12.3 16GB

                      1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                      • bonemap
                        bonemap last edited by

                        Hi John,

                        I have had some issues with PNG files in the past but it has been intermittent. Have you tried restarting your machine? Another option is to try a .psd photoshop file for your transparent top layer.

                        best wishes

                        bonemap

                        http://bonemap.com | Australia
                        Izzy 3 STD/USB 3.2.5 | MBP 16” 2019 2.4 GHz Intel i9 64GB AMD Radeon Pro 5500 8 GB 4TB SSD | Mac Studio 2022 M1 Max 32GB | OSX 12.5.1 Monterey

                        1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                        • dbini
                          dbini last edited by

                          Hello Bonemap,

                          the psd appears with the transparent area as white, the png has it looking black.

                          i have had issues with transparency in Isadora before, most notably when texture-mapping 3D Particles - some of them end up opaque and some stay additive or transparent, but I couldn't work out what was going wrong....

                          going to try a reboot now.....

                          John Collingswood
                          taikabox.com
                          2013 MBPR 2.3GHZ i7 OSX11.7.4 16GB
                          & 2019 MBPT 2.6GHZ i7 OSX12.3 16GB

                          1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                          • bonemap
                            bonemap last edited by

                            Hi,

                            There is this thread

                            where @mark suggests using "the FFGLPremultiply actor after the Picture Player and before any other actors".

                            cheers

                            bonemap

                            http://bonemap.com | Australia
                            Izzy 3 STD/USB 3.2.5 | MBP 16” 2019 2.4 GHz Intel i9 64GB AMD Radeon Pro 5500 8 GB 4TB SSD | Mac Studio 2022 M1 Max 32GB | OSX 12.5.1 Monterey

                            1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                            • dbini
                              dbini last edited by

                              thanks for your suggestion bonemap, but, unfortunately, that hasn't helped

                              John Collingswood
                              taikabox.com
                              2013 MBPR 2.3GHZ i7 OSX11.7.4 16GB
                              & 2019 MBPT 2.6GHZ i7 OSX12.3 16GB

                              1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                              • keftaparty
                                keftaparty last edited by

                                @dbini : would you post a patch with your 2 images that I can try it here in the same conditions as you ?

                                Best

                                Mehdi

                                ...
                                Mehdi Toutain-Lopez
                                www.toutain-lopez.com

                                1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                • dbini
                                  dbini last edited by

                                  here it all is: press room.izz + white-house-press-briefing-roomALPHA1.png + 

                                  (other files are not uploading, but the offending png is here)

                                  John Collingswood
                                  taikabox.com
                                  2013 MBPR 2.3GHZ i7 OSX11.7.4 16GB
                                  & 2019 MBPT 2.6GHZ i7 OSX12.3 16GB

                                  dbini 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                  • dbini
                                    dbini @dbini last edited by

                                    (the image files are large because i don't yet know the resolution of the projector - i'm going to scale them down when i get in the studio on Thursday)

                                    john

                                    John Collingswood
                                    taikabox.com
                                    2013 MBPR 2.3GHZ i7 OSX11.7.4 16GB
                                    & 2019 MBPT 2.6GHZ i7 OSX12.3 16GB

                                    1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                    • dbini
                                      dbini last edited by dbini

                                      I found a fix! i set the Video Image Processing preference to Smallest, rather than Default and it works. (although i don't know why it works, i'm glad it is solved)

                                      also: i used smaller versions of the image files. it still doesn't work with the originals.

                                      thanks for all your support on trying to solve this,

                                      john

                                      John Collingswood
                                      taikabox.com
                                      2013 MBPR 2.3GHZ i7 OSX11.7.4 16GB
                                      & 2019 MBPT 2.6GHZ i7 OSX12.3 16GB

                                      keftaparty mark 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                      • keftaparty
                                        keftaparty @dbini last edited by

                                        @dbini Your patch works out of the box for me. Changing the video image processing pref. doesn't change anything for me, but I'm running windows version.

                                        Maybe a bug report would be good. I have the feeling it should not react like this.

                                        Best

                                        Mehdi

                                        ...
                                        Mehdi Toutain-Lopez
                                        www.toutain-lopez.com

                                        1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                        • dbini
                                          dbini last edited by

                                          changing the Video Image Processing pref to default also kills bonemap's frog, so its looking more like a bug, so to speak, rather than incompetent file management on my part.

                                          John Collingswood
                                          taikabox.com
                                          2013 MBPR 2.3GHZ i7 OSX11.7.4 16GB
                                          & 2019 MBPT 2.6GHZ i7 OSX12.3 16GB

                                          1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                                          • bonemap
                                            bonemap last edited by bonemap

                                            Hi,

                                            I just wonder if there is a setting somewhere that is causing the issue? I know the option under File/YUV enabled or disabled can cause issues with image files. YUV should be disabled, I believe.

                                            It appears very unusual to me - I have never had that problem with photoshop files.

                                            What Isadora version are you working with? I can’t recreate your issue with transparency using .psd file.

                                            Cheers

                                            Bonemap 

                                            http://bonemap.com | Australia
                                            Izzy 3 STD/USB 3.2.5 | MBP 16” 2019 2.4 GHz Intel i9 64GB AMD Radeon Pro 5500 8 GB 4TB SSD | Mac Studio 2022 M1 Max 32GB | OSX 12.5.1 Monterey

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